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Post by Deleted on May 10, 2019 13:21:52 GMT
DEKE , have you looked into peanut hay? A couple of goat friends in Florida were talking about it a year or two ago, said that the goats really liked it, and they thrived on it.
You missed this in an earlier msg
"Our local alfalfa replacement is peanut hay. It is a tropical relative of peanuts, a legume, and makes for really high nutritious, high protein feed. But it doesn't bale real well and the fields require a complete round up stripping, then plant peanut runners, wait three years while you wage war on any weeds, and then you have a great field for maybe 10 years and you start all over. I don't have the patience for that."
Another advantage of peanut hay is that it is one of the best soil builders out there. The root mats can be a couple of inches thick after a few years and they trap carbon and nutrients to deepen the top soil. It's good stuff. I just lack patience.
Mea culpa. That's what I get for skimming instead of perusing. 
Yeah, that would be a definite downside to using peanut hay.
Well, there's always kudzu...
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Post by Ozarks Tom on May 10, 2019 13:53:39 GMT
It appears I've missed an opportunity, I should have been hauling alfalfa square bales to Florida all these years. Figuring a capacity on a 53' trailer of about 700 bales, the difference in price from here to there would leave a gross margin of $12,250 per trip.
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Post by Jolly on May 10, 2019 16:06:53 GMT
Not peanut hay, but I've seen a couple of years where the soybean yield was pretty bad. Bad enough that the guys didn't combine them,but cut the bean plants and made hay.
Wonder how good soybean is?
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Post by Deleted on May 10, 2019 19:58:19 GMT
Not peanut hay, but I've seen a couple of years where the soybean yield was pretty bad. Bad enough that the guys didn't combine them,but cut the bean plants and made hay. Wonder how good soybean is? I won't feed soy to my livestock. Their bodies aren't made to convert the estrogens properly, and they don't absorb the nutrients as well.
But I am still in for trying kudzu. Just not enough to risk growing it.
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Post by ceresone on May 10, 2019 22:03:55 GMT
I can't imagine the prices! Tom, I don't live that far from you, our local MFA couldn't get hay, my SIL had to drive to mtn grove to pay 8.50 A bale for poor quality grass hay..glad my horses aren't particular. My older one gets alfalfa pellets with his feed every day..he,s in his middle 30's
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Post by joebill on May 11, 2019 2:01:16 GMT
Used to be an outfit over by Benson that made Timothy hay and the guys with race horses went nuts over it.
That thing that puts the hay in rows is a swather, prob'ly. I have known a couple of guys who had them and said they represented a dependable part time job keeping them running, but I dunno if they are all that way. Bailers can be kinda picky, too.
Simply cannot describe all of the things I would do to avoid going into a small hay operation, but if I listed them it would look more like a book than an article. Guys I knew had been doing it 30 years and still had stuff to learn about when it was too wet or too dry to bale or other stuff that has escaped me since then. He dropped by one morning to get his daily can of skoal and usually he was worrying over the weather. This time he said he didn't care if it rained or not, because he was going to lose a cutting over here if it did or over there if it did not.
Might be a LOT simpler where you are, and if so I hope it works out for you......Joe
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Post by Deleted on May 11, 2019 14:41:08 GMT
I can't imagine the prices! Tom, I don't live that far from you, our local MFA couldn't get hay, my SIL had to drive to mtn grove to pay 8.50 A bale for poor quality grass hay..glad my horses aren't particular. My older one gets alfalfa pellets with his feed every day..he,s in his middle 30's We scrambled for hay, and our regular hay guy scrambled for us to make sure we had enough. In the event that he couldn't find anything, dear friends over in Galena were willing to hook us up, too.
The last of the hay we have right now is similar to what you describe, ceresone. Not much more than grass from the lawn, but if they're hungry and need the roughage, they'll eat it. Sheep far less picky than my beloved goats. Still, thanks be to God that things are greening up. I make sure they get a good feed of some hay before they head down to the valley to browse, so we don't end up with digestive issues.
Praying that the rain lets up long enough to bring the hay in by the end of the month, or we'll be scrambling for hay yet again.
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Post by Jolly on May 11, 2019 14:52:25 GMT
Had a buddy of mine that was famous for pulling the leg of an unsuspecting person, especially if they were city folk. One particular time, he was waxing on about how cheaply one could raise cows. The person he was talking to, asked about feed costs, hay costs during winter time, etc.
My buddy told him in a dead serious tone, that he had solved the feed and hay problem...He bought each cow a pair of cheap green goggles and fed them pine straw. Thinking it was grass, they grew off just fine...
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Post by joebill on May 13, 2019 10:02:21 GMT
All of this feed conversation leads me to suggest a book title. My copy was sent me by a mutual friend of the author, just because I had worked the area for years where the author's ranch was, and he and I both spent some years making mesquite furniture from mesquite sawlogs cut in the area. Not sure if I ever met the author or not, but I think I would have liked him because I certainly liked his book and modes of operation. "good years for buzzards" www.amazon.com/Good-Years-Buzzards-John-Duncklee/dp/0595532446Looks like one can find the book used for around 5 bucks, and if there is a tip in there you can use about feeding out livestock in bad times, it should show you a profit. If not, I found it quite entertaining.....Joe |
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Post by DEKE on May 13, 2019 12:46:03 GMT
Armed with lots of research about comparable equipment and prices, DW and I went to the auction on Friday. There were 7 big round balers that went from $5500 ( a great price) to $14000 (high but not terrible price). There was the one square baler we wanted and not much interest in it except for me and two other guys. My research showed that I could get the same make and model in the 15 to 5 year old range for anywhere from $5K to $9.5K. But for those I would have to drive up to a 1000 mile round trip to get it.
First guy dropped out at $7000, I bid till $9500 and was instantly over bid to $10000. I had really hoped to buy it and then hand her the buyer's ticket and say, "Happy Mother's Day" but there was no way I was paying more, because there is an auction premium of $350 that gets added on. Sometimes crazy stupid people show up at the auction. I've seen used half rotten fence posts sell for the same price as new ones.
DW and I watched the other hay equipment like the rakes and tedders auction off so that we could get a good idea of value, but we came home empty handed other than we stopped by the local manure hauler with our dumper and brought home 5 tons of stall sweepings to fertilize our fields.
I called my buddy and told him we might have to go on a road trip and he was ready to leave that night. He loves a road trip as long as we find a casino to play poker somewhere along the way.
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Post by Ozarks Tom on May 13, 2019 13:22:00 GMT
Auctions can be just downright nuts sometimes. I've seen people buy electrical tools without ever seeing them run for roughly the same price you could buy them new with a warranty.
That said, I've bought a lot of commercial woodworking equipment at auctions. A funny thing I noticed was the heavier equipment like molders and double-end tenoners always went for less than the more portable stuff. I finally figured out that most people buying woodworking equipment didn't have 3 phase power, or a forklift to move that big stuff around.
I bought a 4 head molder one time that was 6 years older than me for $750. Single big motor running a wide belt to the heads and drive. Had a machinist buddy put new bearings in everywhere for another $300, and it was so well made we could set it on Monday and by Friday you could check it with a mic finding only negligible change.
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Post by Thtwudbeme on May 13, 2019 13:40:40 GMT
Armed with lots of research about comparable equipment and prices, DW and I went to the auction on Friday. There were 7 big round balers that went from $5500 ( a great price) to $14000 (high but not terrible price). There was the one square baler we wanted and not much interest in it except for me and two other guys. My research showed that I could get the same make and model in the 15 to 5 year old range for anywhere from $5K to $9.5K. But for those I would have to drive up to a 1000 mile round trip to get it. First guy dropped out at $7000, I bid till $9500 and was instantly over bid to $10000. I had really hoped to buy it and then hand her the buyer's ticket and say, "Happy Mother's Day" but there was no way I was paying more, because there is an auction premium of $350 that gets added on. Sometimes crazy stupid people show up at the auction. I've seen used half rotten fence posts sell for the same price as new ones. DW and I watched the other hay equipment like the rakes and tedders auction off so that we could get a good idea of value, but we came home empty handed other than we stopped by the local manure hauler with our dumper and brought home 5 tons of stall sweepings to fertilize our fields. I called my buddy and told him we might have to go on a road trip and he was ready to leave that night. He loves a road trip as long as we find a casino to play poker somewhere along the way.
Hehehe...
My evil plan worked. 
I will now sell you that same baler for the paltry sum of $13,000 and you will not have to make that 1000 mile round trip. I still have to cover the auction premium and make a little profit.
Actually, I hate auctions for the most part. I was at an estate auction years ago and the only thing that I wanted from it was a roll top desk. Standing on the side of the hall I was the only initial bidder (I was also wondering why the vast majority of the bidders were standing in the back of the hall) and I thought that I had it won with a single bid. Then suddenly out of the blue another "bidder" appeared and raised my bid. It went back and forth for a bit, but I could never make out who it was that was allegedly bidding against me. I never saw anyone indicate that they were bidding. The bidding went above what I was planning to spend and I never again indicated that I was bidding more and yet the auctioneer twice looked in my direction and raised the bid.
I called out to the auctioneer and as nicely as I could explained to him that I was not bidding further and stopped a ways back. People in the hall started giggling. The auctioneer looked at me as if he was PO'ed and suddenly yelled, "Sold", in the direction of the other alleged bidder. I started to leave when one of those standing in the rear of the building clued me into what had happened.
This auctioneer had a bit of a reputation of making up bidders in order to raise the bids. Especially to individuals that were not standing in the back of the hall, because it was difficult at best for those individuals to see if anyone else was actually bidding. Hence, the reason for people standing in the rear of the hall. They could see everything and not get hoodwinked.
About a week later I went back to see what would be available for the next auction and there was the roll top desk that I was bidding on. I asked about it and the auctioneer said that the person that was bidding against me backed out and then asked if I was still interested in it. I replied that I was but only at the original bid that I placed unless he could come up with the name and telephone number of the individual that was bidding against me. He mumbled something about that being unethical and let me have the desk for the original bid.
After I loaded up the desk I informed him that he might have a few undercover State Police at his next auction. He feigned ignorance and asked why that would be. I told him that I had called the staties and explained what it was that I thought had happened and it turned out that I was not the only one to have complained about the exact same thing. I also told him that the staties were getting really tired of hearing about this and were going to do something about it.
At the next auction there were a bunch of people there that none of the regulars had ever seen before. The entire auction went as smooth as a baby's bottom. The auctioneer seemed to be on his best behavior. I even bid on and won a freezer for much less than it was worth. Before the auction I went up to the regular and explained to him all about me actually buying the desk a week later and that I had spoken with the staties and told the auctioneer about the staties' response. He giggled and laughed about it. He then commented that the staties must be serious because of all of the new people there, but he never thought that they would allocate some 20 officers to stake out the auction.
I told the regular that I could only account for 15 of the newbies and explained to him that they were my friends and I asked them to show up because I could not depend on the staties actually showing up. The regulars really got a good laugh out of that.
I heard a few months later that the staties finally busted the auctioneer for fraud.
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Post by joebill on May 13, 2019 16:43:45 GMT
I was at an auction in Tucson and the auctioneer had a leather sewing machine up for sale, commented he once bought one just like it, cost him I think it was $8000, which was completely out of line for that machine. I arched my eyebrows at another guy I knew and he told me it was a true story. The guy bought a stolen one and his lawyer charged him about $7K to keep him out of jail and the rest was fines and court costs.
Any time I am looking for used equipment, I start at the new equipment dealer. In most kinds of machinery, they trade for it, never get it fixed up and painted to sell, it just stacks up. I used to buy old cars that ran after you hot wired the ignition from new car dealers for $25 and drive them for years. They had already sat out back and made the place look bad for months and nobody could find the keys any more, so I would offer the $25 and if they said yes I would go get it started and check it out before paying, in case it had a rod hanging out or something.
Nobody values old used machinery lower than the guy who had the new stiff for sale.....Joe
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Post by Jolly on May 13, 2019 17:07:19 GMT
Dad probably bought somewhere between 150-200 used cars a year through the auctions, but he always bought them before they hit the ring. He had guys he dealt with all the time, and I've been with him when they'd tell him, "Jolly, you don't want that one". That's all they had to say.
I think in 15 years of car auctions, he bought exactly one in the ring. They always got bid too high for his blood.
People, there is a reason they have free beer at car auctions...They want you to overbid.
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Post by Ozarks Tom on May 13, 2019 19:24:29 GMT
Here's my best auto auction story from back when I had a Texas dealer's license.
It was my habit to take a guy with me to the auction in Ft Worth, where I'd buy three old cars that had no rust, and at least sort of ran. We'd tow bar them down to Corpus Christi where if I'd paid $600 in Ft Worth I could turn them for $800 there at least.
I'd run to the concession stand, and when I got back in the bleachers there was a good looking little '62 Chevy 2, blue & white, looked to move back and forth good. The bidding had already started, so I couldn't look it over real well, but I got it with my second bid, about $300 less than I was willing to go.
After the auction we went to the lot to pick up the cars, and found everything except that Chevy. Walked from the front to the back, all through the place. Finally got back to the front, and there it was, right near the corner. How in the heck did I not see it? Well, I'd seen it, but didn't recognize it. The entire passenger side was wiped out, like someone had sideswiped a wall at 60mph.
Just dumb luck, but a guy I knew who ran a salvage yard had the same car with a blown motor. I ended up losing a few bucks after the swapping of parts, but it taught me to not bid on anything I hadn't walked around.
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